Special Guest: Alison Donaghey

Greetings Magnificent Souls to the Attract Health Build Wealth Blog where we have open and honest discussions about ourselves. 

This is a place where we breakdown, breakaway, and breakthrough codependency allowing ourselves to attract health, build wealth and live a peaceful life.

We are tired of being sick and tired. We are tired, but we are not giving up. We KNOW that there is something magnificent inside of us.

Because we are fighting daily, hourly, and by the minute: fighting ourselves, our kids, our spouses, we have to do things differently. 

We have to break the cycle. We don’t have a million chances. We have to be happy, NOW. We have to find a way. So how do we do that? How is that possible?

If you look around at what society is telling you, they’d tell you that what we’re doing is impossible. 

Yet, it’s happening. 

Every. 

Single. 

Day. 

It’s happening through the practice and love that we call Awakening the Magnificent Soul.

We are all Magnificent Souls, and these are our stories of healing!

Today in Episode 47, I am sharing a great conversation I had with Alison Donaghey from Domino Thinking. We talk about her thoughts about codependency, self-worth, and self-talk.

But, before we get into the discussion, don’t forget to let me know your thoughts about this episode, any feedback you have, or anything you’d like me to cover on future podcasts at epiphanyvault.com

Remember, you can share anonymously; it is a safe place and I would welcome the discussion.

Okay, on to my discussion with Alison. This was a really good one and filling one for me. I felt so much connection and joy after my discussion with Alison. Alison Donaghey is the creator of Domino Thinking and fills the world with all the goodness on her podcast and with her online resources and materials. I love the way that she looks at the world and I hope you enjoy our conversation as well. Here is my guest, Alison Donaghey.

Lilli: Welcome, Alison, to the podcast. I wanted to start off with the first question that we normally do with our guests, which is, how do you define co-dependency and/or how has it affected your life, or touched you at all?

 Alison: Great question. And thanks for having me here, it's so nice to see you again. Codependency, I think what it is is an agreement to exchange our... Give our worth away willingly to another person, and they're willingly giving their worth away to us. And so there is this power struggle around worth, and I think worthiness underlines every choice we make, because that's my jam. And I think what it is, is that, if you and I are in a codependent relationship, you are taking from me and I'm allowing that to happen in order for you to feel good. And then I am taking from you or falling victim and doing everything you're asking me to, which means I'm taking your worth away 'cause I'm saying you can't take care of yourself, I have to take care of you, and that's how I'm gonna get my worth.

And so what it is, is just really us stealing our worth from each other, and God knows I have found myself in that situation, which is what allows me to talk about it. I lived with a drug addict for six years. And if there is any more of a co-dependent relationship, I am not sure what it is, but here I am trying to support him in his addiction and yet completely overlooking any of my own needs. But I got to sit back and feel like the superior one, and he got to do drugs whenever he felt like it. So, it was a super unhealthy relationship, super damaging. And I would highly recommend to anybody that's in it, just figure out how to get out of it.

Lilli: Yeah. Which it sounds like that you are in a healthy place right now, which is awesome.

Alison: It's certainly not to say that any co-dependent relationship is less than... It's not a contest. It's just I get that whole co-dependency thing.

Lilli: Absolutely. I love how you talk about self-worth because I tend to touch on that a lot here, because in my experience, what I realized was, due to my family origin growing up, I was creating and really going right in the pattern with my relationships of my mother and my father is that it really... Basically, I had no self-worth. I defined co-dependency as a complete disconnect from myself which, not having that self-worth, I wasn't able to make decisions for myself. I feel like a lot of the decisions that I made throughout my life was based on what other people wanted of me, but I didn't have the wherewithal to... Or the self-worth muscle, I guess you could say, to make those decisions. So, I love how you talk about that.

Alison: Well, I think that worth comes from one of two ways. That's how we get our worth. I think it's a fundamental need, and we are born miraculously. When you think about it, that's pretty crazy how the sperm and egg made us, and we never look at a baby and go, "Oh, no, not a miracle at all." We look at them more like, "It's miraculous. This baby is a miracle." And so that means we were, at one time, a miracle also which means we have inherent worth. And then the world tells us we're not good enough, then we spend all of our time trying to get our worth back. So, there's one of two ways we get worth. We're either gonna get it internally, which is a really healthy way of doing it, like, "I'm okay regardless of what you're doing." Or we're gonna get it harmfully or externally by saying, "I am going to do this for you so I can feel good." And there's a reliance on another person in order for us to try to get our worth, but in order to do that, we're stealing their worth and it's this illusion that we have values, it's an illusion that, "I'm doing everything for them, I'm such a good person." And we disguise that as internal healthy worth, and it's just it's not.

Lilli: Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. One of the things that I like to think about with self-worth, too, is, like I said, it's a muscle. How do we find that balance? I really honestly think that I'm still working on that balance...

Alison: And you will forever be working on that balance.

Lilli: Yeah, okay.

Alison: Sorry, but spoiler alert.

Lilli: Yeah. Thank you for affirming that. And I also like when you said nothing is ever perfect, which I agree as well, and I think there's a lot of pressure to be perfect, whether that be with ourselves or in relationships.

Alison: Yeah. When we realize that we're never going to believe, get to that place where we are completely and absolutely 100% operating from a place of internal worth, it's peaceful. It's like, "Oh, I can relax, I don't have to be perfect." And the fact that all of our formative years was filled with people telling us to do things differently, that we weren't doing it right, that we weren't good enough, we weren't smart enough, tall enough, more like our sisters, like our ex-boyfriend, we're not enough, those layers are so deep we'll probably never get to the bottom of them. So, I think what we can hope for is to operate at 70% internal worth. I think that's a really good place to live. I think it's reasonable, it's attainable. And I think if we can start understanding worth and then start relating it to our choices and ask ourselves, "Where is my worth coming from in this situation?"

 If you're having a conversation with somebody and you wanna convert them to your point of view, ask yourself, "Where is my worth coming from?" Your worth is coming from converting them so that they agree with you. Now you feel right and right is powerful, and now I feel worthy, that's an illusion. If you're having a conversation with somebody and they disagree with you, and you're like, "Okay, that's cool. Where is my worth coming from? Oh, it's coming from internally, because I don't need them to do anything to feel good right now." So, every time we enter into a situation, if we're able to say, "Where is my worth coming from?" It'll help us really start to recognize those unhealthy victim places and get us to stay focused in that really healthy free space.

Lilli: Yes. Yes, that's powerful. That's awesome. That's awesome.

Alison: Yeah. And it's such a better a place to live. It is just... It makes everything so easy. You look at your situation, you're like, "Is this healthy for me? Is this going to boost my internal worth?" No? It's a no. So easy. We think it's gonna get super complicated, but it simplifies everything.

Lilli: It sounds easy. I wouldn't necessarily... My personal experience, the application is far from easy. And I think...

Alison: Oh. The application is, yes. The more you practice it, the easier it gets. If you have an apple and orange in front of you, and you're like, "What's gonna make me feel good? Well, the dentist always says I have to eat the apple, so I better eat the apple." Where's my worth coming from? Oh, pleasing the dentist. I'm gonna have the orange. Right?

Now, it's possible you want the apple and the dentist wants you to have the apple, in which case go hard, have the apple. But you have to ask yourself first, "Where is my worth coming from?" And there are processes that you can use and put in place. And it is tough. Like, I still find myself... Obviously, I'm not 100%, I find myself in these places and I'm like, "Ooh, that was just a victim statement I said right here. Why can't they just do this for me? It would be so much easier if they could just do that." I catch myself all the time. And so the importance is remembering and catching yourself. And so now I get out of it so much faster than I used to. I used to be in it for a year. Now, I'm like, 20 minutes, good.

Lilli: What do you do... And I'm on that level, too. Like I said, I felt like I was so disconnected from myself. My instincts were so off, my intuition was so off, but then when I started to learn about why I was so unhappy or what... Trying to put two and two together with my life and everything like that, those little things, those little, I don't know, pinches, I guess I would describe it, which is, "Oh, this doesn't feel right." So, you get to that point. But what do you do after... If you can go back to your experience in your beginning stage, and you're at the point where you're finding out new things about yourself and you get that inkling, "That doesn't really sound right," or that questioning thing that you got going on in your head, what do you do after that? Do you journal? Do you just sit and ponder and you talk to yourself about it? I don't know. Do you have any practical advice as far as that goes?

Alison: All of the above. It's going to be different things for different people. I have a system that's free on my website, it's called BRAVE. Because I think we do have to be really brave to step into this, because it is a lot scarier than we think it is... Which is not to say it's not scary. When we change, people will drop out of our life. The people that can't handle that change in ourselves, the people that can't handle the boundaries that we're putting up, we are going to lose people as we get healthier. That is just the way it is. I don't think I have met anybody who's gone from being unhealthy to healthy and not lost people in the process. From that perspective, it can be really scary to do. But we think that when we start acknowledging our part in something, when we start saying, "Oh, I see how I was manipulating the situation to get them to feel sorry for me," that we are going to lose power. But the opposite happens when we say, "Oh, I get that I was doing that." We actually gain power because we're seeing ourselves.

 And so I think it's a brave thing to step into, and the more we do it, the easier it becomes and the freer we become. But we have to take that leap. There are times that I don't wanna let go of some of the crap that's happening in my life, because it's safe there. Anyway, so I've created this system called BRAVE. And the very first step is B for you wanna breathe. When something happens and we get shocked, like, "I can't believe they just said that to me." That feeling lasts for about four to seven seconds. And after that, it becomes the story we tell ourselves. So, somebody says something mean, "Oh," four to seven seconds, wait, pause. And then our brain starts working. "You know what, my mother used to say that to me when I was a kid, and that person is really horrible just like my mother. And you know what else my mother used to do to me when I was a kid? Oh, she did this, and this, and this. And, oh, my God, you know, I'm never gonna be good enough." This has nothing to do with what that person said to us. This is 100% story.

 So, the way to stop that story from happening is to breathe. And I know people are like, "Why do I have to breathe?" There are so many different breathing techniques. Pick one, I don't care which one you pick. You can breathe in for five, hold for three, breathe out for seven, hold for two. Whatever it is that you wanna do, just figure out a breathing technique that works for you. A friend of mine, Amy, she has a beautiful one that she does. You put your feet on the ground, and you focus all of your energy between your feet and the ground. And it's almost impossible to think while you're doing that because all of your attention is at your feet. You can even try something like that.

 If you breathe beyond those four to seven seconds, now you're at choice. So you know whatever happens after you're done breathing is on you. So, if after you breathe, you're like, "You know what, she's just like my mother." That's a choice. You are choosing to step into that victim place and give your worth away. So, it's really, really important to stop that narrative and you can do that just simply by as soon as you feel that reaction coming, stop, breathe. And breathe beyond the seven seconds. Don't be timing it so that you can get on your reaction. You want to breathe 10, 20, 30 seconds so that you really create that distance. That's the first step of the Brave system.

Lilli: Got you. I love that. I love that, too, that you talk about choice. Because, like I said, I could say it over and over again, but it's so true, is that I think a lot... Actually, I know a lot of listeners out there just feel like, whatever situation they're in, they don't have a choice. They have to be there for whatever reason, whether that be loyalty, whether that be their family. I have one of my listeners write in and asked me, "Is co-dependency so bad? It's kept my family together." Which I can't answer that question. But I do think that it's important to realize that you do have a choice. Again, I use this platform because I talk just about my experience, but I didn't feel like I had a choice. The only time I felt like I had a choice was when I was at the depths of despair and almost took my life, and then I realized, well, shit has to happen or it's no good from here. That's kind of what got me from the bottom. But I think that's super important. I love that, choice.

Alison: So important. When I lived with the drug addict, I felt like I had a child. I was on welfare, I asked welfare for assistance to move out, and they said, "No, your situation is not so bad." My parents were like, "You made your bed, you lie in it." And part of that was I hid a lot of it. He was an IV drug user, it doesn't get much worse than that. He was one step away from being on the street with a crack pipe and an IV needle. He was just... It was bad. I truly felt like I had no choices. I couldn't go to... At that time, the only women shelter was for battered women. I wasn't being battered. I wasn't prepared to lie and say I was because of the consequences from that lie. So, I felt like I had no choice but to stay. I could have been homeless, I could have taken my son and gone and lived on the streets until I could figure something else out, and then welfare would have had to have helped me or something would have had to intervene, but they could have taken my child away.

So, I certainly understand that space of feeling like you have no choice, but not making a choice is still a choice. And when we can step into that and go... If at that time I was able to go, "You know what, I am choosing to stay here," I would have actually been building internal worth because I would have declared something, I would have been coming from a place of power, as opposed to a place of victim. "It's not my fault, I have no choice." There is no power in that statement.

Lilli: Yeah. Power, ownership. Yeah, I love that. Absolutely. I'm still honing that choice muscle myself to this day, but it has more to do with where I wanna go eat food, rather than who am I gonna spend my time with or who am I going to give my energy to. Yeah.

Alison: And that's one of the beautiful things about this COVID, this space. We have spaced. And everything is a double-edged sword. When you have COVID, you've got the really crappy side and a really great side, and it's up to you which side you choose to focus on, which doesn't mean the other side doesn't exist and we don't have to acknowledge that it's there. But one of the beautiful things that I have found is it's given space, it has shone all of these light on these things that I couldn't see when I was busy. And I realize how busy I make myself when I'm uncomfortable. Now, I just have to sit in being uncomfortable and work my way through it. It's been a real gift that way.

Lilli: I don't know, I would encourage people out there, if you are struggling maybe with co-dependency, just to feel... I would acknowledge what the choices that you are making, whether that be... If it's something... It doesn't have to be so difficult as, "Should I be in this relationship or not," which you do have a choice, but that's up to you on whether you wanna make that or if that's good for you. I don't know. I would start honing that muscle. It just made me think about, if you can start thinking about what choices you do have, you'll realize that you do have a lot actually, superpower.

Alison: Yeah, yeah. And I love what you say about that. You gotta count those wins. "I chose to get out of bed today." That was a choice, that was a win. "I chose to hug my kid today." That was a choice, that was a win. We think that these choices, like you're saying, is only those big "do I leave this relationship or do I stay or not?" But maybe we can't answer that question until we start acknowledging those really good choices that we're already making.

Lilli: Yes. Chills, I just got the chills.

Alison: I love that.

Lilli: Nice. We are gonna close it out right now, even though I know we can talk forever, obviously.

Alison: Probably.

Lilli: It's been such a pleasure having you on here, Alison, and I know...

Alison: Thank you so much.

Lilli: My pleasure. I know my listeners would wanna connect with you. Where can they find you?

Alison: Dominothinking.com is the easiest place. It has the free download, there's no obligation, like email or whatever, but you can unsubscribe as soon as you get it. My feelings won't be hurt. But definitely check it out. And my podcast is on there, the course that I offer is on there, so everything you need to know about me is there. And most importantly, my contact information is on there, so if you need to reach out to me, definitely feel free to do that. I answer all of my emails personally, and so of those ones, 'cause they do come to me, and sometimes it takes me a couple of days to get to them, but I promise you I will get to them.

Lilli: Nice, awesome. And I will link all of that stuff up for you to make it easy for the podcast, for our listeners out there as well. But I really appreciate your time, thank you so much for coming.

Alison: Thank you. I appreciate what you're doing in the world, so thank you so much for showing up they way you do. Thanks.

Lilli: Thank you.